Naruto Saigen Roleplay

So typically I'd post this in the minor announcements but this pertains a larger change that several of you will have to abide by. Summons have been changed to allow for permanent summons, however they follow a strict set of rules when permanently summoned.

Stat Change
Summons now max out their stats at 265 instead of 250. Reason being is summons are meant to be strong companions, but only usable for a little bit at a time due to their strain of being summoned in the world.

Ability Slots
Summons now have two ability slots to be used. Again this is the same reason as the last one, the two ability slots allow them to be stronger, however summons are meant to be a large strain on the user. As they are a being from a different realm.

Permanency
Summons now can have permanency, however they're not meant to be combat viable in any way while in this form. Permanency is now called shadow summoning as they're no more than a plot aide while in this form. The summon's stats are defaulted to 1, and are unable to use any jutsu of any kind. However they can still interact with the world and people as normal. To be used combat effectively, however, you must perform the Spirit Summoning jutsu, which will resummon the spirit under your aide as combat effective. It will resummon by your side as normal, and can be carried by the owner despite carrying rules. For the owner to be carried by the summon, however, they would have to perform a full Spirit Summoning.

Shadow Summons usually look just like their original forms, except smaller. Any summons higher than D-rank can only be as large as the max size of the rank below them, meaning that a B-ranked Shadow Summon can only be as big as a C-ranked Summon's Max Size. This shrinking can be proportional, or can alter the original summon's appearance slightly to give them a "chibi" look.

And that is our changes to summons. Changes for permanency are asked to be handled asap.

Link to Summon Rules (Updated)

Oh dang, aiit cool thanks.

Also I forgot to mention this in the announcement, but these changes were made by Rain. So big thanks to him for doing the write-up.

At least the update solidifies what I want to do with my spirit guy, thanks for the update.

Oh, finally!
Though, what about the carrying rules? If their stats are 1 when perma, that would usually mean you can't carry them beyond 1 speed which kind of negates the permanency a little bit.

Say I have a dragon summon that i keep as perm, could i have it take on a separate form while perm? Like a wyrm while perm and dragon when summoned into battle?

WrightJustice:

Sat Sep 02, 2017 3:05 pm

Oh, finally!
Though, what about the carrying rules? If their stats are 1 when perma, that would usually mean you can't carry them beyond 1 speed which kind of negates the permanency a little bit.

they're basically immobile when perm if stuck at 1 speed so this does need some kind of rectifying

Niro:

Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:39 am

WrightJustice:

Sat Sep 02, 2017 3:05 pm

Oh, finally!
Though, what about the carrying rules? If their stats are 1 when perma, that would usually mean you can't carry them beyond 1 speed which kind of negates the permanency a little bit.

they're basically immobile when perm if stuck at 1 speed so this does need some kind of rectifying

I believe the carry rules would be more combat based, whereas in normal socials this is just one of those "responsible rp" moments. At least that is where Tydie and I were landing on it.

I'll check with others.

1 Speed is 1 speed, that's what they're limited to moving at. Stats don't behave differently in/out of combat.

I'm not saying they do.

Nevermind, I'll leave this to someone else to address. I'm not going to get pulled into your need to criticize someone just for being part of staff.

I'm not sure where in my two sentences I even said anything that could be regarded as criticism. I only spoke about stats and how they function.

Please reread my comment before making your own baseless ones.

I think we should really not rely on "responsible rp" since that can easily be abused. Is there a way we can make it so the summon's sp/str isn't negligible and useless? Like making it 1/2 or 1/3 rounded down? Cause 1 sp/str is kinda :\ even for a shadow summon

I mean, if we are really keeping to the idea that Shadow Summons are purely for plot, why even bother allowing them to physically interact with the environment? Just make them visible, ethereal beings that can keep all their stats and move with the summoner but they can't physically do anything to the human world. It keeps them as plot devices, allows them to move at normal speed, kinda win win. And it is relatively simple system-wise.

Or give people the choice to either do this or give the summon a physical form but their stats get reduced.

This is a dumb argument. If its for plot purposes, who cares. The moment it becomes a situation where someone is engaging a character in a manner where the rules have to be respected then you switch over. Until then, ride them at 57speed for all I care.

Disregarding the fact that from a system perspective that makes like 0 sense, if that is the staff mindset, which it seems to be based on posts and likes in this thread, then at the very least add that to the rule. If these types of summons are treated differently based on whether or not they are in or out of combat, document it. Or do we want to get in the habit of making unwritten rules again?

Give me and PR to discuss it and we'll get back to you. We haven't had much of a chance to talk about it over the weekend.

Even with what I have to discuss with PR, that's definitely a negatory.

Your perm summon will just look like your regular summon minified. You can make it look chibi if you like, but it'll just be like your regular summon in appearance. We'll be putting up exact size limits soon

Does this change the amount of stats Realm Summon spirits get or are they still functioning off the pet stat table? Since spirit companions have increased starting stats now.

Why would size change?

Realm summonings and Tenkujutsu in general are staying the same for the forseeable future.

And I don't get your question, Kit. Why would they do any of the things we're making them do? The size would change to a smaller one that's probably going to be around the max height of around 7 feet or so. Size in and of itself is a tool, so to get the full size of a summon, you'll need to actually summon it.

But why? Especially since they are only used for social purposes

What point in size change if they're ethereal?

Edited so that Shadow Summons can now be carried by their users, but not vice versa, regardless of combat or not. To ride a summon, you'll need to perform a regular summoning (like always). This allows people to use their summons personalities and existence for plot, but not have advantage of what summons can do without their drawbacks.

As for why size: It's partially flavor and it's partially because size can inherently be a tool. Explained further how the shrinkage works as well.

But why though? If it's for plot purposes, why can't we ride them and have them regular size and then have to summon them when we need em for a fight?

"I have too little chakra linked to this world to assist you in battle, summon me and I will assist" type thing?

Well being able to ride them suggests they have some physical capability which does kind of go against the idea of them not being fully there.

Though I still don't get the shrinkage. If they're shadow summons and can't properly interact then what does size even do for them? Also flavour-wise it makes less sense that they shrink since they're shadow summons not mini summons, which to me suggests they should appear full size but maybe have an ethereal kind of feeling to them.
The idea of them being ethereal also lends itself to the flavour of breaking the usual carrying rules since it can be like a special ethereal link that lets them move wherever the summoner moves (aka being carried).

In the end there's no actual reason for the size shrinking as far as I can see since they're "shadow" summons that can't interact in the first place, and to me it makes less flavour sense that they would shrink when they're all ethereal.

Kit, because this is what they are. The companions are balanced against each other, summons are stronger, pets are more useful for plot. This was a compromise that didn't have to be taken so that people can use their summons personalities in threads, it wasn't meant to let you traverse distances faster or look more intimidating by having a chakra creature thing by your side.

As for flavor, the idea being that this is a lesser version of the original in all regards, Wright. This is a demo version of them that they've managed to bring into our realm, it's not a projection or a hologram. It makes just as much sense to keep t hem the same size as it doesn't, it's up to where you want to tilt the flavor and we have chosen to tilt in this direction.

And again, I remind you that if you want it to do anything beyond what's listed, you just have to summon it fully.

Legit, then why not just actually summoning the thing in a social rp since chakra doesn't matter? Making this new rule pretty useless, no?

Nope, just makes you arguing about it useless.

People wanted to be able to have their summon hang out with them indefinitely without needing a chakra cost or having to perform a jutsu, and now thats an option.

Hmm I dunno if rules changed soon after or I read them wrong but I originally read that the summons can't interact with anything physically kind of like the academy clones, which would in fact make sense why they're "shadow" summons so that's where I got my flavour from.

That being said I suppose shrinking in size makes more sense but now I know I made that mistake the name "shadow summon" doesn't sound like as good of a name for them anymore, also the flavour of all their stats becoming 1 is now lost.